Deal dispute agains't SonicRefs for over 15 000$ in unpaid work

[524]

Yes, and you have yet to prove otherwise: any orders you did complete (very few) you never showed proof of!

The orders im referring to here, again are orders where my account was banned from along with yours. so you cant just take the fact that you completed x amount of orders and at the same time strip it of its context

These orders both of us are referring to, 1. you dont have proof of and 2. i never received a DM from those customers. following those 2 points, it means that i wasnt paid for those orders and neither was there a trace (proof) that you completed them. not from you, and not from the customers

If they were at least visible to me or you, then you would have been able to show me the username of the customer alongside with it, and at the bare minimum, some proof of completion. that way i can ask the customer for payment, and pay you your fee

but you have provided none of that here, neither have you done in our previous conversations about this 

The extent of my "logs" is the order groups im in, beyond that, i do not store logs. since youre so confident that you truthfully did complete $15k worth of orders, where's your list of that? where are the screenshots or at least usernames of these completed orders that would prove your work was completed? you dont have any of this, so it doesnt matter what you say or claim!

You didnt provide sufficient evidence here for any of these completed orders, if you do have this evidence, then you would have opened this scam report months ago!

Instead, you opened it as soon as you saw that i have another big case ongoing and attempting to capitalize on that pressure, you decided now is the perfect moment to open this report

The context cant just be ignored here @Alex. this person could have claimed i owe him $100k if i had simply told him something along the lines of:

"Im expecting to get 500 orders within the next few months and you have the opportunity to make $100k from them"

Does that mean im now locked in and the $100k is guaranteed? no, the agreement is predicated on him completing the $15k worth of orders, yet he isnt capable of showing any sort of proof showing us that hes completed even a fraction of that amount. let alone $15k worth of completed orders

Broken down, $15k worth of orders (completed and payment is due) is equivalent to approximately 50+ orders

So he needs to have had finished 50+ orders at the bare minimum

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[19]

Yes, and you have yet to prove otherwise: any orders you did complete (very few) you never showed proof of!

The orders im referring to here, again are orders where my account was banned from along with yours. so you cant just take the fact that you completed x amount of orders and at the same time strip it of its context

These orders both of us are referring to, 1. you dont have proof of and 2. i never received a DM from those customers. following those 2 points, it means that i wasnt paid for those orders and neither was there a trace (proof) that you completed them. not from you, and not from the customers

If they were at least visible to me or you, then you would have been able to show me the username of the customer alongside with it, and at the bare minimum, some proof of completion. that way i can ask the customer for payment, and pay you your fee

but you have provided none of that here, neither have you done in our previous conversations about this 

The extent of my "logs" is the order groups im in, beyond that, i do not store logs. since youre so confident that you truthfully did complete $15k worth of orders, where's your list of that? where are the screenshots or at least usernames of these completed orders that would prove your work was completed? you dont have any of this, so it doesnt matter what you say or claim!

You didnt provide sufficient evidence here for any of these completed orders, if you do have this evidence, then you would have opened this scam report months ago!

Instead, you opened it as soon as you saw that i have another big case ongoing and attempting to capitalize on that pressure, you decided now is the perfect moment to open this report

The context cant just be ignored here @Alex. this person could have claimed i owe him $100k if i had simply told him something along the lines of:

"Im expecting to get 500 orders within the next few months and you have the opportunity to make $100k from them"

Does that mean im now locked in and the $100k is guaranteed? no, the agreement is predicated on him completing the $15k worth of orders, yet he isnt capable of showing any sort of proof showing us that hes completed even a fraction of that amount. let alone $15k worth of completed orders

Broken down, $15k worth of orders (completed and payment is due) is equivalent to approximately 50+ orders

So he needs to have had finished 50+ orders at the bare minimum

You keep contradicting yourself. First it was “no orders,” then “some were paid,” then “maybe 5 unpaid.” Even if it’s just one order, I expect to be paid for it.

You keep saying there’s “no proof” while ignoring why. I don’t have access to the proof because you never added me back to the tickets. Right after my account got banned, I asked to be re-added so I could verify the orders and get paid, and that never happened.

Let’s be clear on what actually happened: I completed the work, my account got banned, and instead of re-adding me so I could access the tickets and get paid, you didn’t. You had full ability to add me back, you had access to everything, and you chose not to. That’s not a coincidence, that’s you avoiding payment by keeping me locked out of the proof.

It’s been 1.5 years. @Alex Telegram kept getting banned, @Liars doesn’t reply, and I was ignored the entire time. Meanwhile, the proof is still in your ticket system, you still have access to it, and you still chose not to add me back. That’s not a lack of proof, that’s you controlling access to it. And the idea that it happened a year ago so it doesn’t matter is irrelevant. It doesn’t matter if I open this now, next year, or in 10 years. I never got paid, so I’m owed.

I’m not going back and forth anymore. I did the work, my account got banned, I asked to be re-added, you never added me back, and I never got paid. You can verify everything yourself. I’ll let staff handle it.

TL;DR for staff:

I completed orders, my account got banned, and I immediately asked to be re-added to get paid.

He never added me back. He still has access to the tickets. He claims “no proof,” but the only reason I don’t have it is because he kept me locked out after the work was done so he wouldn’t have to pay me.

[524]

Buddy the report was opened by you, so the burden of responsibility to provide any sort of proof falls on you, not me. and telegram banned your account, not me. i cant do anything about that

Ive also lost so many customer DMs and orders (most of them not being related to your orders), it was a mass ban wave on many refunding services coming from telegram's staff 

I was literally getting spawn camped! i got banned many times in a row!

it was your responsibility to store and keep track of your orders that i assigned you to. if you have completed an order its your job to log it in our DMs so i pay you once you reach a set amount of orders or when you decide you want to cash out  

Also what ticket system? i dont have a ticket system lol.... all orders are processed first on telegram DMs, and then delivered/executed by you, the worker in the order group

If i "store logs" then no one would want to deal with me as a lot of my customers use their real information which they wouldnt want compromised in any way shape or form

This is common sense in refunding and in any serious fraud type of service, extensive logs outside of the platform thats being delt on ARE NOT stored

My account was banned back to back to back within the span of a few days and i lost all the order groups i was in multiple times. there are no "logs" whatsoever

Im the one thats not gonna go back and forth anymore because your claim is absolutely RIDICULOUS and youre reaching so hard here!!!

YOU are the one who opened a $15k dispute on cracked.ax. YOU have a MASSIVE burden of responsibility to be the one who provides all the proof supporting your initial claim, and so far you have provided none!

This is such a money grab and its way more than enough of a convincer when you consider the timing of the report...

This shit happened ages ago, but you opened the first group on telegram where you added @Alex & @Liars MONTHS later (this is where you explained to them how you got "scammed" for the first time)

So you had just got "scammed" for $15k and decided to fuck off and wait for months, and only now you decided to open the report?

I cant sense any urgency at all which further proves that you kind of knew in the back of your head, this is a far reach!

Youre also not even being specific or particular at all with anything. it is highly expected of you to be as particular and as specific as possible about everything if you want anyone to even consider this report with seriousness  

You refer to your "orders", "completed work", "finished chargebacks" but never specify how many orders, the amounts, the names of the order groups, the telegram handles of the customers or anything else thats intelligible or specifiable

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[19]

Buddy the report was opened by you, so the burden of responsibility to provide any sort of proof falls on you, not me. and telegram banned your account, not me. i cant do anything about that

Ive also lost so many customer DMs and orders (most of them not being related to your orders), it was a mass ban wave on many refunding services coming from telegram's staff 

I was literally getting spawn camped! i got banned many times in a row!

it was your responsibility to store and keep track of your orders that i assigned you to. if you have completed an order its your job to log it in our DMs so i pay you once you reach a set amount of orders or when you decide you want to cash out  

Also what ticket system? i dont have a ticket system lol.... all orders are processed first on telegram DMs, and then delivered/executed by you, the worker in the order group

If i "store logs" then no one would want to deal with me as a lot of my customers use their real information which they wouldnt want compromised in any way shape or form

This is common sense in refunding and in any serious fraud type of service, extensive logs outside of the platform thats being delt on ARE NOT stored

My account was banned back to back to back within the span of a few days and i lost all the order groups i was in multiple times. there are no "logs" whatsoever

Im the one thats not gonna go back and forth anymore because your claim is absolutely RIDICULOUS and youre reaching so hard here!!!

YOU are the one who opened a $15k dispute on cracked.ax. YOU have a MASSIVE burden of responsibility to be the one who provides all the proof supporting your initial claim, and so far you have provided none!

This is such a money grab and its way more than enough of a convincer when you consider the timing of the report...

This shit happened ages ago, but you opened the first group on telegram where you added @Alex & @Liars MONTHS later (this is where you explained to them how you got "scammed" for the first time)

So you had just got "scammed" for $15k and decided to fuck off and wait for months, and only now you decided to open the report?

I cant sense any urgency at all which further proves that you kind of knew in the back of your head, this is a far reach!

Youre also not even being specific or particular at all with anything. it is highly expected of you to be as particular and as specific as possible about everything if you want anyone to even consider this report with seriousness  

You refer to your "orders", "completed work", "finished chargebacks" but never specify how many orders, the amounts, the names of the order groups, the telegram handles of the customers or anything else thats intelligible or specifiable

This still doesn’t add up, and the more you explain it, the worse it looks.

You’re now saying there was no system, no tickets, no logs, yet you were the one creating groups for every order and adding me, Sonic Jr, and the customer into them. That is your system. You were directly managing and witnessing every order in real time.

So which one is it? No tracking at all, or group-based tracking that you personally controlled?

You also claim I never did the work, yet you, Jr, and the customers all saw my responses in those groups. You were literally present. You can’t pretend nothing happened when you were in the same chats watching it unfold.

And let’s talk about your own statement, you said you take pre-payment. So let’s break that down:

Customer pays you → I do the work → you keep the money → I don’t get paid.

Explain how that works in your favor without it being exactly what it looks like.

You’re also trying to downplay the amounts, but the proof was already shown in the videos and screenshots. Even using your own estimate, we’re still talking thousands, and that doesn’t even include additional orders completed after that.

Then you turn around and say my work is “ass,” yet you were asking me for my templates so another worker could use them. If the work was so bad, why were you trying to reuse it?

Make up your mind.

And the timing argument you keep pushing is pointless. You say this was “over a year ago,” yet that group you’re still in was created in February. February to March to April. We’re in April. This wasn’t some ancient issue, it was ongoing, and when it kept getting ignored, it was brought to the forum.

At the end of the day, this is simple:

• You created the groups
• You added everyone involved
• You took pre-payment
• You saw the work being done
• You never paid

Then you fall back on “no logs” while you were the one connecting everything and handling the money.

You can’t claim there’s no system when you were the system.

I have a screen recording of everything if staff needs.

[524]

Youre mixing everything up all together 

I said we dont keep extensive logs of orders, customer data, and anything that encompasses those customers & orders, outside of telegram 

I didnt say anything about not managing my own orders, or not helping you manage the orders i assigned you to

Youre really dancing around the main points and wasting everyone's time. paragraphs and paragraphs in and you have yet to produce any sort of evidence of me scamming you

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[19]

Youre mixing everything up all together 

I said we dont keep extensive logs of orders, customer data, and anything that encompasses those customers & orders, outside of telegram 

I didnt say anything about not managing my own orders, or not helping you manage the orders i assigned you to

Youre really dancing around the main points and wasting everyone's time. paragraphs and paragraphs in and you have yet to produce any sort of evidence of me scamming you

You keep saying “no proof” while ignoring why there’s no access to that proof.
You controlled the tickets. You created the groups, assigned the work, and had full visibility. When my account got banned, I asked multiple times to be re-added so I could verify completion and get paid. You never did.
Now you’re using that same lack of access as your defense. That’s backwards. You locked me out, then say “no proof.”

You also keep contradicting yourself:

• First: no completed orders
  
• Then: “very few”
  
• Then: some unpaid but you “didn’t get paid either”
  
• Then: you would’ve paid if customers DMed
  
• Then: I should’ve logged everything elsewhere
  

Which one is it?
Even one unpaid completed order proves your argument is wrong.

You’re also twisting this into “unfinished work” or “projected earnings.”
That’s not the claim.
The claim is simple:
I completed work → got banned → asked to be re-added → you didn’t → I couldn’t access tickets → I didn’t get paid.

Your “abandoned work” point is also misleading.
Why would I keep working when:

• previous work wasn’t paid
  
• I wasn’t being re-added to tickets
  
• and I had no way to verify anything
  

No one keeps working under that.

The timing argument is irrelevant too.
I tried resolving this privately. Telegram bans, no replies, no resolution. Going public was the only option left.

At the end of the day:

• You ran the system
  
• You controlled the tickets
  
• You had the ability to re-add me
  
• You didn’t
  

And now your entire defense relies on missing access that you caused.

TL;DR for staff:
Work was completed → account got banned → Sonic didn’t re-add → no access to tickets → no payment → now he uses that as “no proof”
That’s the issue.

[524]

I locked you out? how did i lock you out? many times in this report you just say stuff without anything being definable

Following both of our account bans, BOTH of us lost all access to these order groups, not just you... so i didnt "lock you out"

Several times in this report youve claimed that i replaced you on orders that you completed, meaning i would owe you payment for these completed orders

If an order is completed there is no worker to replace, i would just collect payment and close it out. subsequently you would immediately be added back to this order group to log it as a completed order, or i would myself notify you that x order has been completed, and i owe you payment for it

But this simply isnt the case! because at the same exact time, you basically stopped updating your tickets, disappeared for days on end and left all your orders without providing a status update!

THOSE are the ones that prompted me to replace you on all orders, and those orders not being completed ones (orders lacking updates)

You are not owed payment for orders you lazily started, and eventually abandoned for days, and weeks on end

I myself used to catch you during this time being highly active in several public refunding group chats on telegram, where you were casually chatting

For orders which i had the ability to readd you to, its my decision and choice whether or not i add you back to them (not referring to "completed orders" here)

If you WERE actually actively updating your orders i wouldnt have replaced you on all your pending orders

None of what ive mentioned above qualifies as a scam. what WOULD qualify as a scam would be completed orders that are unpaid. but you have yet to provide any sort of evidence showcasing this because you dont have it

In your false series of events, you claim that SOMEHOW:

- You completed an order - > coincidently telegram banned both of us right after

- I was added back by the customer - > i didnt add you back, instead i added a different worker

But wait... i thought you "completed the orders", so why would i add back another worker? what would the other worker do in a "completed order"? why would i pay another worker if theres no work left to be done for this "completed order"?

Your series of events is in and of itself contradictory and lacks any sort of logic

Here we are, more paragraphs and paragraphs in and youre still dumping your AI slop rebuttals into this report but so far, no proof has been produced that shows us $15k worth of completed orders

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[19]

I locked you out? how did i lock you out? many times in this report you just say stuff without anything being definable

Following both of our account bans, BOTH of us lost all access to these order groups, not just you... so i didnt "lock you out"

Several times in this report youve claimed that i replaced you on orders that you completed, meaning i would owe you payment for these completed orders

If an order is completed there is no worker to replace, i would just collect payment and close it out. subsequently you would immediately be added back to this order group to log it as a completed order, or i would myself notify you that x order has been completed, and i owe you payment for it

But this simply isnt the case! because at the same exact time, you basically stopped updating your tickets, disappeared for days on end and left all your orders without providing a status update!

THOSE are the ones that prompted me to replace you on all orders, and those orders not being completed ones (orders lacking updates)

You are not owed payment for orders you lazily started, and eventually abandoned for days, and weeks on end

I myself used to catch you during this time being highly active in several public refunding group chats on telegram, where you were casually chatting

For orders which i had the ability to readd you to, its my decision and choice whether or not i add you back to them (not referring to "completed orders" here)

If you WERE actually actively updating your orders i wouldnt have replaced you on all your pending orders

None of what ive mentioned above qualifies as a scam. what WOULD qualify as a scam would be completed orders that are unpaid. but you have yet to provide any sort of evidence showcasing this because you dont have it

In your false series of events, you claim that SOMEHOW:

- You completed an order - > coincidently telegram banned both of us right after

- I was added back by the customer - > i didnt add you back, instead i added a different worker

But wait... i thought you "completed the orders", so why would i add back another worker? what would the other worker do in a "completed order"? why would i pay another worker if theres no work left to be done for this "completed order"?

Your series of events is in and of itself contradictory and lacks any sort of logic

Here we are, more paragraphs and paragraphs in and youre still dumping your AI slop rebuttals into this report but so far, no proof has been produced that shows us $15k worth of completed orders

You’re arguing semantics instead of the issue.
Call it whatever you want, but after my account got banned, I asked to be re-added to tickets I worked on and that didn’t happen. Result: I lost access to the only place where proof exists.

You’re also mixing things on purpose:
I’m not asking to be paid for unfinished orders. I’m talking about work done before the bans that was never properly reconciled.

You contradict yourself too:

• “If completed, I would add you back or notify you”
  
• “It’s my choice whether I add you back”
  

So payment depends on you re-adding me, but you didn’t. That’s the problem.
 
Your “no proof” argument is circular.
The proof is in tickets I was part of, that you controlled, and I wasn’t re-added to. Then you say “no proof.”

TL;DR:
Work done → bans → no re-add → no access → no payment → now used as “no proof”